I can’t tell you how much I love this pic.
Sorry a man was foolish to test his law-breaking with 3 powerful animals, but imagine the chaos of that scene.
No doubt money was involved in his criminal activity, and he paid dearly. Poaching is illegal, anywhere, whether it be a caribou in Canada, a whitetail deer in Maine, or a rhino on the plains in Africa.
At least the editors were smart enough to not give the deceased the title of ‘hunter,’ as hunters obey all game laws and understand conservation.
But look at that face. Is there any other animal on earth that strikes such fear and wonder such as that, and even from a distance, or seeing the image on a screen? Awesome, no wonder the darn things are called the king of beasts.
Now consider for a moment if you will, this same creature pacing in the den with that man of God Daniel. Hmmm. Daniel did not test God by walking foolishly in the den of hungry animals. Nope, he was tossed in, and therein lies the difference, as God protected him.
The poacher ran unsent, and he pretty much was on his own, so before folks start crying me a river as to ‘where was God,’ we are all accountable for our actions, and it was his fault that his children are now fatherless. People should obey stop signs.
But once more, love that expression up top.
The Lions Den 
I also dislike poachers with a passion and this one got his just deserts.
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I’m pretty sure I mentioned the criminal component, but if we all got ‘what we deserve’ for nefarious acts, the world would be very less populated.
Since you are here, the thought occurred to me, if there is a God, then perhaps are atheists poachers of sorts, benefitting from every emolument that life presents, feeding them with the best of fruits, warming them with leather, while at the same time ignoring the very One who does not trample them to death, or eat them for mischief?
Grace is a pretty good word.
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I should imagine the poacher was of either the local tribal religion or a Christian considering these beliefs were clashing and the nut jobs were performing the old Christian tradition of burning people suspected as witches.
Grace is the name of woman I know.
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Of course you should imagine steve. You are a product of John Lennons ‘Imagine there’s no heaven, its easy if you try……………’
You do live in the fantasy world of imagination where love does not exist because you can’t see it or prove it………..
Go ahead and argue with yourself, and you just may have your eyes opened.
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Yes CS there is no heaven and “Chapman turned against Lennon after making his religious conversion; he was angry about Lennon’s well-publicized 1966 comment that Beatles were “more popular than Jesus.” (Google)
You see how a good man and a fantastic musician with a great future was killed by a Christian fanatic? Indoctrination leads to fanaticism that leads to mental problems. Try and control your brain, most people struggle, but that is where fantasy is turned into truth for many theists and believe me when I say that my eyes have truly been opened.
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Christian killed him? In your dreams Steve. I’m sorry but u are truly clueless as to what Christianity is.
Can I suggest you read up on Mr Webster’s marvelous dictionary rendering of ‘fools.’
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@sklyjd
We don’t have much success providing justice. At best, our “justice system” maintains order.
How desperate was that poacher? Don’t know. You don’t either. We just know he is dead. He made what turned out to be a bad choice.
The Bible helps us to make good choices. Atheism just tells us that our choices don’t much matter.
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“The Bible helps us to make good choices. Atheism just tells us that our choices don’t much matter.”
How does that work Tom? It is all very well throwing out these kind of statements that have no substance without identifying what you actually mean?
I can tell you if all your choices come from the Bible, where in fact do you draw the line as to what you choose to do?
I expect you may want to draw the line at stoning to death adulterers, and if your hand or your foot causes you to sin, you will not cut it off and throw it away, and I expect eating shell fish and pork and wearing mixed linen and wool fibres may not be your thing either.
Atheists use their own judgements to make choices, they do not need divine intervention to do this, and it does matter to atheists because everything we do wrong usually impacts on someone else, and atheists do actually care equally as much as Christians.
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Could you address the obvious? You did advocate what you believe. You just attacked Christians.
You are an Atheist. If your neighbors are just biological machines — if you are just a biological machine — why does anything matter?
The Christian answer is that we are not just machines.
You say God does not exist. If that is true, then why should you care about anything? What is your alternative to a God who offers us eternity with Him?
You say you care. Why? If there is no hereafter, why isn’t it all about making you happy while you you? And why should anyone believe a word you say?
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“You are an Atheist. If your neighbors are just biological machines — if you are just a biological machine — why does anything matter?”
“You say God does not exist. If that is true, then why should you care about anything? What is your alternative to a God who offers us eternity with Him?”
God existing or not has absolutely nothing to do with what I care about. Do you not believe atheists are human? Are you really so far out of touch with reality that you see atheists as not being complete emotionally motivated humans, are we like robots or machines?
Can you not understand the concept of believing in the real simple uncomplicated life just as it is? I cannot think why would anyone want to force any supernatural god, devils, demons, evil Satan, sin, heaven and hell, into a child’s life.
I think I have truly underestimated the power of indoctrination when theists literally have no understanding that the atheists natural coherent world of rationality, happiness and beauty, and then actually believe it cannot be justified without a deity and therefore atheists must be unemotional biological sinful machines. This is so bizarre that it could become a Munster movie.
You have chosen to live your life for your mentally generated God to gain eternal life in heaven simply because the Bible says this is so. I seriously suggest you do not believe everything you read Tom.
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You just don’t get it steve. CTom is showing you the relevance of humanity. If there is no God, then you are no better than a weasel, a rat, or a lion who devours its prey and then goes for a nap.
WHO decides your relevance? You? Based on what? What universal law makes it wrong for the lion to kill your dog or wife?
Wake up already. God did not make you a parrot. But maybe in the atheist worldview you are a higher animal…………..
As for me, I am not. Thank God.
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You just keep attacking Christians. When I ask you what you believe, you just keep on attacking, even including stuff you just make up.
Do I believe Atheists can love others? Yes, but without God how is that rational? That is up to you to explain. Since the existence of God is obvious, this a problem you have created for yourself.
Do I believe in the God of the Bible? Yes. Is that belief logical and rational? Yes. People far more wise than you or I have made the case for believing.
What finally convinced me? Reading the Bible. Since the Bible is His Word, I say God convinced me.
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“You just keep attacking Christians.”
The best form of defence is providing the truth, do you call that attacking Christians?
“Do I believe Atheists can love others? Yes, but without God how is that rational? That is up to you to explain. Since the existence of God is obvious, this a problem you have created for yourself.”
Love is rational, balanced, normal, coherent, sensible, realistic, wise and logical between humans, no gods, deities or spirit entities required. God is so far from being a reality outside of the theists mind and that much is blatantly obvious, and this is not a problem for atheists as you claim, (when did I claim that?) it is actually the problem for theists.
“Do I believe in the God of the Bible? Yes. Is that belief logical and rational? Yes. People far more wise than you or I have made the case for believing.”
Regardless of how wise you think you may be, the powerful forces of the human mind will create any reality you want to be true.
“What finally convinced me? Reading the Bible. Since the Bible is His Word, I say God convinced me.”
If you had been born in Pakistan or Saudi Arabia Tom, you would have said the same thing about reading the Quran.
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Just because you make an assertion of truth does not make what you say the truth.
People are more easily persuaded to believe something different than you think. Otherwise, we would still be worshipping the gods we now call mythical. Instead, our forebears chose to be Christians.
You say wonderful things about love, but Atheists don’t seem to have had much success with it. Pagan societies, essentially atheistic, were rigidly hierarchical and warlike. Modern atheistic societies have been much the same. Christians, on the other hand, developed the idea of freedom of religion. That lead to representative democracy and civil rights.
The idea of a perfectly holy God is actually quite scary. So why can’t I truthfully say you have made up your own gods, human reason and science?
I ask again. What do you believe? Why? What makes it true?
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“People are more easily persuaded to believe something different than you think. Otherwise, we would still be worshipping the gods we now call mythical. Instead, our forebears chose to be Christians.”
Exactly right Tom, the forebears choose this Christian God and ditched the rest. This is what has happened right through history since the first gods were invented. Therefore, our history shows us this will happen again to this latest crop of mythical gods, and it has already started, I read that Ryan Burge, a political scientist at Eastern Illinois University and a Baptist pastor, found that 23.1% of Americans now claim no religion and this is because young Americans are hungry for facts and curious about the world, and that information can only be provided by science.
“You say wonderful things about love, but Atheists don’t seem to have had much success with it. Pagan societies, essentially atheistic, were rigidly hierarchical and warlike. Modern atheistic societies have been much the same.”
This statement is pure fiction. I guess you believe Christianity is squeaky clean when it comes to war and the suppression of human rights. I am going to ask you to expand on how bad modern atheistic societies are compared to Christian societies before I start dragging out the bad stuff you should already understand about your own religion.
“Christians, on the other hand, developed the idea of freedom of religion. That lead to representative democracy and civil rights.”
You must believe I am wet behind the ears, however I thought you should know this from a quick Google. The earliest democracy in the world began with the work of a man named Cleisthenes, in Athens, in 510 BC. And again info from Google. On December 1, 1955, the modern civil rights movement began in your country when Rosa Parks, an African-American woman, was arrested for refusing to move to the back of the bus in Montgomery, Alabama. And from Wikipedia. The foundations of modern human rights began during the era of renaissance humanism in the early modern period.
“The idea of a perfectly holy God is actually quite scary. So why can’t I truthfully say you have made up your own gods, human reason and science?”
Your God may be scary for you. You will know that worship, religions and gods go together as one perfectly. Atheists on the other hand do not worship anything that is perceived as godlike or have an ideology such as a religion does so no we have not invented new gods, human reason and science are real things that impact on all of us, even you, and make the world go round.
“I ask again. What do you believe? Why? What makes it true?”
I disbelieve in any gods; however I do believe the scientific research regarding our existence, biological makeup etc. This is because the scientists are doing the research on finding out what, why and when that often lead to inventions such as radar, communications, computers, mobile phones, electric cars, space travel, artificial limbs, medicines, surgical techniques etc. This is so real, it is true.
I doubt this makes any sense to the indoctrinated mind.
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So our forebears choose this Christian God and ditched the rest? You mean you didn’t really mean it when you said it is just inevitable that I would believe whatever my parents believed?
Do I think Christians are squeaky clean? No. When I throw rocks, I do so reluctantly. Christians think of their churches as hospitals for sinners. The Apostle Paul spoke of himself as the greatest of sinners. He actually had Christians killed for being Christians. Still, because we each desperately need Jesus Christ, Paul repented and preached the Word of God.
Is preaching the Word of God worthwhile, even in this life? Who would choose to live in an Atheistic state? You? Then pick one and move there.
Is the pendulum currently swinging towards Atheism? Yes. Will Atheism triumph, or will we have a Christian revival? I pray we will have a Christian revival. It has happened before. What will be? What God wills.
What about that earliest democracy? That one in Athens. At its zenith half the population was still enslaved, and it didn’t last. When the Roman Republic came along, half the population was still enslaved, and it didn’t last.
Why were these republics so fragile? They were just rational compromises between people who sort of liked each other. When Athenians saw other peoples, they saw enemies. When the Romans saw other people they saw enemies. When Athenian and Roman citizens looked upon their slaves, they saw people they had abused. Fear and hatred of other people, even their slaves, made the Athenian and Roman republics unstable.
What about today? If you take the time to read “Politics” by Aristotle, you will find we still face the same problems governing ourselves that people faced in Aristotle’s day. What is different is that Christians believe that all men, not just the elites, are made in the image of God. We all can choose to be His children.
Consider how Paul looked upon those who accepted Christ.
Paul did not see other people as enemies. He saw others as potential Christians or as Christians God would make perfect. He saw each Christian as someone engaged in a struggle against slavery, sins of all kinds. He saw each Christian as a brother or sister turning to Christ for salvation from sin.
Christians understand that true freedom comes from being free from sin. We believe God has commanded us to love Him and all humankind, all His children.
Love of neighbor is the foundation upon which the founders of the United States built an imperfect government, imperfect because we love imperfectly.
Do I fear my God? Yes, but not the way you do.
Fear is only the beginning of wisdom. Love is the consummation of wisdom.
You say you disbelieve in gods. You say you believe in science. Is that not what I have said you believe? Don’t you idolize science and reason? How does what you believe allow you to decide the difference between right and wrong?
Don’t you have the same problem the Pagans had? When the Pagans worshiped gods of their own creation, they worshiped their own desires. Instead of existing for their gods, their gods existed for them. Hence they defined right and wrong in accordance with their wants and needs, not in accordance with obedience to their Creator. The Pagans defined worship as doing whatever was required to get their god to give them what they wanted, not giving glory to their god.
Thus, the Pagans effectively worshiped themselves, not the One who made them.
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“You mean you didn’t really mean it when you said it is just inevitable that I would believe whatever my parents believed?”
Like everything in this world, things evolve, some very slowly over many years, sometimes decades, hundreds, thousands or millions of years, as all religions will until they are replaced or die out.
“Who would choose to live in an Atheistic state? You? Then pick one and move there.” “I pray we will have a Christian revival. It has happened before. What will be? What God wills.”
I am already in one Tom. Australia does not care much for religious promotion or bigotry and in fact your own country has more people than ever walking away from Christianity and declaring themselves of no particular faith, therefore you should seriously re-evaluate the lack of evidence for all religious ideologies.
“you will find we still face the same problems governing ourselves that people faced in Aristotle’s day.”
I agree about the same problems and it does not matter what governing system we use there are always major problems due to human failings, and that is one good reason to avoid taking political sides in most issues.
Why were these republics so fragile?
Anything so complicated as governing needs an extremely long time to mature and become effective. It took the Romans hundreds of years to learn how to effectively rule their empire, however after 500 years they could not hang on to it and they self-destructed, so they never got it completely right. In fact the British Empire was just as fragile and in fact the North American status as the major world power today is also fragile.
Religions are like governments, they will eventually dominate, change or collapse, even many religious people who are “made in the image of God” are criminally involved and are similar to every other criminal or activist regardless of beliefs and all end up bringing down their own systems.
“Do I fear my God? Yes, but not the way you do.”
And in what way would that be Tom? Do you not realise I fear no supernatural phenomena, not your God, your Satan, your angels, the devils, ghosts or any deity you want to name? Bad drivers and nutters with guns, now you’re talking.
“Don’t you idolize science and reason? How does what you believe allow you to decide the difference between right and wrong?”
No and no, I do not understand a lot of science, I do have a keen interest in it because science has made a dammed good job of explaining and providing evidence for everything we do know. I appear to have a natural ingrained ability to know what is right and wrong and this is an evolved moralistic attribute along with many other non- violent and social skills that have attributed to the human survival. You only have to look at any group of animals to understand this.
“Don’t you have the same problem the Pagans had?” “Thus, the Pagans effectively worshiped themselves”
Of course not, silly question because atheists disbelieve in any and all gods, and how does a person worship themselves? I doubt vanity is a particularly strong attribute among atheists, maybe some pride and confidence but no survey has been done as far as I know.
(EDITOR’S CHOICE- ‘Supposedly this commentator thinks ‘science explains everything we know…………………’ I paraphrase. Newsflash: Science explains NOTHING. Theories yes. Assumptions yes. ‘Science’ has no intelligence. ‘Science does not care if a man believes men came from apes or a fig tree. What was supposedly ‘true ‘yesterday is tomorrows lie. Men idolize science, as CTom as asserted time and time again. Steve is boringly repetitive in his stubbornness. Don’t be a steve. Don’t be a fool and worship yourself.
The book of Romans explains men perfectly in ANY and EVERY age: ‘professing themselves to be wise………..they became fools.’ Men worshipped science then too, because idolatry is timeless.) Creation is obvious and knowable, exactly the way God wired humans. And of course God’s word never lost an argument.)
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So I evolved? Why are you still lagging behind?
You think you live in an Atheistic state? 🙄
According to the stats, Australia isn’t hugely different from the USA. So you are just kidding yourself.
https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/geos/as.html
What is the primary difference between Australia and the USA? I am not familiar with Australia’s laws, but the USA generally protects the freedom of its citizens with more rigor than is seen even in other western style democracies. Therefore, I suspect government has more power to stifle religious belief than it does here.
So it took a long time for the Romans to figure out how to govern their empire? I think you missed the point. When Julius Caesar crossed the Rubicon, the Roman republic was already dead. Caesar Augustus, that is Gaius Octavius Thurinus, just maintained the facade of a republic. Later emperors didn’t even bother with that.
Religions are like governments? Some are. Christianity isn’t. Jesus told us to render unto Caesar what is Caesar’s and God what is God’s. When we can’t tell the difference, that’s a problem. Then some people are trying to turn government into the state religion.
Anyway, you still have not addressed the question: what do you believe and why? Please explain how you discern what is right and what is wrong. Thus far, as ColorStorm has observed, all you can do is ridicule Christians.
Because what God has created is too complex for us to perfectly understand, we cannot fully discern the truth. Some even say there is no truth. How then do we ascertain what we should believe about God?
God poses an especially knotty problem. Any understanding mankind has of God is guaranteed to be imperfect. God is an infinite being. We don’t even have to the capacity to perceive Him. That puts believers in an awkward position. We have to defend the hope we have in our imperfect understanding of God. That’s why I keep asking you what YOU believe. Because my understanding is not perfect, I cannot defend my belief in Jesus perfectly. All I can say with assurance is that belief in Jesus Christ is the best idea, far better than any other idea. All I can say is that Atheism is hopeless and that it requires us to ignore the evidence we do have, that God exists, that He created everything, and that He sent His Son to save us from our sins.
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“you are no better than a weasel, a rat, or a lion”
Thanks CS, equal footing with the animal kingdom is exactly where all humans are regardless of their beliefs.
“What universal law makes it wrong for the lion to kill your dog or wife?”
No universal laws for animals that know how to kill for survival, however the human animal with a most powerfully evolved brain can work out for themselves what is right and wrong.
“Wake up already. God did not make you a parrot. But maybe in the atheist worldview you are a higher animal…………..”
I am simply a more advanced animal than a parrot, and both of us are more advanced than anything perceived to exist in the supernatural world of make believe. Thanks to reality.
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For an advanced animal you are doing an awful job of explaining how the human animal with a most powerfully evolved brain has worked out all by itself what is right and wrong.
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That’s what I was thinking. lol
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